Events » Past Events » Richard Kendall visits Sethnet Online January 18, 1999
Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: Sumari
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:24:43 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
Paul Helfrich asked that my first post include a bit of biographical information, so being the docile type who loves to follow rules, and strict protocol <g> I shall comply.
I attended Jane Roberts’ classes from January 1972 until classes ended in 1975. After 1975 classes continued until 1979, but not on a regular basis. Some of the classes between 1975 and 1979 I attended, and some classes I did not.
For too many years now I have worked as a paralegal at a corporate law firm in NYC, and am determined this year to find a new job, a new challenge, outside of the area of law. Along with Suzanne Delisle, I have a company appropriately called Kendall and Delisle Books. We hold the rights to The Seth Video, Jane Roberts, The San Francisco Interview, published the book Dreaming Myself, Dreaming A Town, and have represented numerous authors in the capacity of literary agent.
I graduated Oxford University as the number one student in class, no wait, actually it was Harvard, (Would you believe Staten Island Community College?) from which I dropped out in the middle of my second year and decided shortly thereafter to hitchhike cross country with two dollars in my pocket. You choose which scenario sounds true. I am a Taurus with Sagittarius rising, like long walks and old movies, and ... sorry, I got confused where I was posting to.<G> Anyway, I do like long walks and old movies, and am addicted to chocolate. Hope this satisfies the bio requirement. Now on to Sethian matters.
The Sumari development occurred on November 23, 1971, a few weeks before I attended my first class, which was January 4, 1972. Reading Sue Watkins’ description of that class in Conversations With Seth I truly wish I had been there that evening. One other regret, more so than just not having been at that class, is that we don‘t have a video of Jane singing Sumari, for it is different than Jane speaking for Seth. She is in a different kind of trance state. When I acquired the rights to the Seth Video, I was informed by the fellow who produced it, that Jane singing Sumari the evening of the taping was filmed, but the producer decided to cut it from the final tape, that it wasn’t that important. So sitting in some garbage dump somewhere in NY state is a slice of celluloid that contains a wonderful piece of the Seth drama, but at least we have audio tapes of Jane singing in Sumari. I loved the Sumari.
Perhaps I can use what is going on in this moment to explain a bit about my feelings and reactions to the Sumari. I live on the ground floor of a two-family house. The family that lives upstairs from me, who are my landlords, consist of a Chinese couple who barely speak English, and their daughter who speaks both Chinese and English. (Moving as well as a new job is another goal I have for 1999, but let me not digress). As I write this, the mother and daughter are having a real knockdown drag out battle. The screaming is all in Chinese, but the feelings of the sounds if I just let myself go with that tells me many things, without knowing the specifics of the fight. And so with Sumari, without knowing the specific meanings of the sounds, as out of control with their own emotions my upstairs neighbors seem to be at the moment, so was the Sumari so in control. As if they sang/spoke from a position of emotional development that allowed them to call upon whatever emotions they chose to display at any given moment, and that display took the form of sound. So in the same way Jane had such vocal command while singing Sumari, so the emotions that traveled with that vocal command, the feelings within the sounds, were displayed with equal command over their elements. And all this was to awaken various emotions and realizations within us, ideally allowing us, or aiding us, in our individual quests to deal with our emotions and feelings, and in dealing with them in a "pure" way, (without restricting their flow or intensity) we could learn to handle them with great command, instead of them handling us, as seems to be happening with my upstairs neighbors, though things seem to be calming down.
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Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: Inner City
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:25:47 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
In 1974, Seth began talking about the formation of an inner city. In Conversations With Seth, Sue Watkins describes the session where Seth first brought up this concept. Working in Manhattan every day, I am well qualified to work as an inner city planner, bringing lots of experience as to what we should not have in such an inner city. I hadn’t thought about this concept in a long time, but last week was reminded of it as I waited in Grand Central Station for a train. Many years ago, I during the time I went to Seth class, I had an experience that I connected with the inner city while standing in Grand Central Station. I don’t recall if it was before or after Seth started speaking about the inner city, but while standing in Grand Central Station (years ago) I suddenly found myself in an altered state of consciousness. It was as if Grand Central Station transformed and was some sort of focal point for inner energies and activities. Even though I was standing in the physical Grand Central Station, my consciousness imposed a different reality over the scene, as if a counterpart or parallel reality of Grand Central Station existed right where Grand Central Station stood, and I was tuning into that parallel reality.
There weren’t specifics that I experienced, just the strong feeling of this other reality. Somehow I felt this was connected to Seth’s discussion about the inner city and I asked him if there was a connection and he said there was. Now here’s an original idea: Perhaps creating such a city on the Internet, using the codicils as a basis for this new civilization, trusting that as we create it and fine tune it on the Internet, we are simultaneously creating and fine tuning it in our dreams, and constructing this inner city even as we just think about it. (Well, maybe the idea isn’t original with me; okay, maybe Lynda Dahl came up with this idea during a conference at New Haven; all right, it was Lynda that came up with this idea, <g> but I like the idea and am officially applying now for the position of Traffic Coordinator. Resume will be sent upon request.
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Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: Jane’s Illness
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:26:11 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
Jane’s illness, and eventual death, has become a topic that has elicited strong responses and reactions from many people. The book The Way Toward Health has also been the subject of many diverse opinions and feelings. First, let me say that I don’t have any special or inside insight as to the drama Jane went through regarding her health. I know as much (or as little) as anyone else regarding the intimate interior nature of Jane’s challenges, beliefs, goals, and cannot from the outside judge her journey.
How can one grade her struggles with physical illness? Do we give her an A for living as long as she did and producing the body of work she produced? Do we give her a D for being sick in the first place, and an F for not healing herself? How do we grade her (and Rob’s) honesty in documenting what occurred. How do we ultimately judge any of our lives and deaths? Do we say that because she did not heal herself, the validity of the Seth material must be questioned? Do we say the fact that the Seth material was created for all those years while she struggled with ever increasing symptoms shows the strength of the material? Do we just accept the fact that like all of us Jane had areas she excelled in and areas she didn’t excel in; had areas she was able to let her energy fly free and soar unrestricted, and areas in which her energy was blocked, and even though she was aware such blockages were the results of beliefs, she wasn’t able to change her beliefs sufficiently to change her outer conditions. (Sound familiar?)
I can only say this: if you judge the validity of the Seth material by what you perceive to be the triumphs or failures of others you are missing the point. And the point is how effectively can you use these ideas in your reality, and the only way to find out is to try them for yourself, and realize no one else’s "failures" or "successes" will ultimately prove the legitimacy of these ideas. Only through your own experiences can you truly judge the validity or lack thereof of Seth’s ideas. And when you can’t manifest the changes you want using these ideas, how compassionate will you be with yourself, or will put yourself down, feel guilty, and call yourself a failure?
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Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: Car rides/Events leading to class
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:26:35 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
Talking took precedence over music on the car rides to class. Talking, laughing, arguing, acting silly, fighting about the heat, whether the windows should have been opened, who got the front seat, who drove, where we stopped for lunch, how long we stopped for lunch before we got on the road again, and gossiping about everyone and everything, such activities usually formed the basis for the car ride up.
On the way home, we usually argued about the true interpretation of things said that evening. So, sound like a lot of fun? Care to join us?
As far as how we were led to Jane’s class (in official terms anyway) I will quote some background notes I wrote only last year, as I tried to organize notes and memories so there would be a personal record for myself, and for others. So let me just quote from some of those notes. Before I do so however, let me just address the other part of your question. I am still in touch with various former class members, though we no longer take long car rides together, and don’t see each other as much as we used to. Many are married, with families, careers, and busy with all the details that such responsibilities entail. As far as revealing the identities of those I went to class with, if you mean identifying the real names behind the pseudonyms in Conversations With Seth, that would be up to each person to decide for him or herself, and various class members have done so. In another post someone else asked about why students used pseudonyms, and I will attempt to answer that when I respond to that post. Here are my notes regarding some of the background events that led us (in official terms) to Jane Roberts’ class.
In 1969, I, along with many of my friends, began studying under a man named Francois Nesbitte. Larry Herschaft, a friend, was the first person to learn of Francois, and he told us about him. Francois claimed to be a spiritual master, who had gained extensive knowledge of the universe, much of it, he claimed, being secret or esoteric knowledge. He called his philosophy The Gnosis. Francois had a growing number of students, but he was particular about the students he would take on or allow to attend the classes he held at his Manhattan apartment. He was going to open a school to spread his philosophy and was training his students so they could eventually teach in his school. He had the future teachers live near each other in Hayden Hall, a hotel in Manhattan. For all intents and purposes, The Gnosis was a cult, with Francois as the leader. We were all in awe of Francois and afraid of him; we hoped to be chosen to be part of his school. He designated a series of books to be read in specific order and also decided when each person could move on to the next book in the series. He did not want the people in the school to mingle with those who were not allowed in the school. In effect, he divided us and pitted us against each other, which put a strain on many friendships. I was excluded from the school, though he did allow me to read the series of books he had prescribed. Francois often made negative comments about people and sought to exploit their insecurities. About me, Francois said "I was in the grips of a demoniacal thing."
In late 1970 Francois made The Seth Material required reading. He told us that Seth was very advanced spiritually, but Jane was messed up, and that she controlled Rob. We later found out from Jane that Francois had spoken with her, and Jane said Francois used to drive her up a wall. He had asked if he or some of his students could attend one of Jane's classes, and she had refused. In the summer of 1971 I wrote Jane a letter asking if I could attend one of her classes. She wrote back saying I could come up anytime, but to let her know beforehand. Jeff Marcus, a friend of mine, who was also excluded from Francis’ school, decided he wanted to attend one of Jane's classes and asked Francois for permission to do so. Francois told him by all means to go, if Jane allowed. On September 20, 1971, Jeff got a lift to Ithaca, NY, and the next day hitched from Ithaca to Elmira to attend Jane's September 21, 1971 class. Jeff didn't have a car at the time. He didn't call Jane beforehand, but she let him attend. Jeff had to go back to work the next day, so he left class after the first hour and a half in order to take the bus back to New York City that night. As a result, Jeff did not see Seth, because Seth came through later in the evening. For the hour or so Jeff attended, class had revolved around a fellow named Wilson Brinker, an older man from Pennsylvania, who is called Martin Crocker in Conversations With Seth.
Francois suddenly died during the last week of December 1971. Those of us who had studied under him felt abandoned, and this spurred us to attend Jane's class. Jeff called Jane and told her Francois had died, and she said someone had already told her. She agreed to let us attend the January 4, 1972 class, which was approximately one week after Francois died. Jeff, another friend, and I went up to Elmira by car. Not long after Francios’ death, one of the guys from NY (let's call him Z) was accepted in the school Francois had started and became one of its leaders. Francois had this concept which he called going beyond. One was not allowed to know what going beyond meant until Francois determined that the person had advanced enough to warrant being told.
I later found out that going beyond meant working with one's dreams, writing them down and interpreting them, and becoming conscious of being in a dream (called an experience by Francois), and trying to control dreams from the inside. Francois believed working with dreams could be very dangerous, and one had to have a certain amount of knowledge to protect one's self.
Even though I wasn't allowed to be in Francios’ school, he did allow me and others to have our own students, to whom we would teach his philosophy. In May 1972, I had dropped all my students except Arthur Fine, a friend. Because of Z's position in the school, he wanted to maintain control over things in general and wanted to be consulted before anyone who had been involved with Francois was brought to Jane's class. I decided to bring Arthur to class without consulting Z. At the time (May 9,1972) Arthur hadn't been "put beyond," and since dreams were openly discussed and interpreted in Jane's classes, I knew Z who now headed Francios’ school would have objected to my bringing Arthur to Jane's class. I decided under the circumstances not to tell him of my plans. Arthur and I left a day early so we wouldn't ride up with Z, thus Z wouldn't know beforehand what Arthur and I were up to. I did, however, tell Jeff. When Jeff and Z were driving up to class the next day, Jeff told Z what I had done; Z was livid and kept saying that I had "stabbed him in the back." Both Z and Jeff thought my bringing Arthur to class was extremely irresponsible. Z wouldn't give a transcript of the class to the people in Francios’ school as he had started doing, for Arthur's name would have appeared in the transcript; and people in the school would have known we brought someone new to Jane's class, which could have ignited some jealousies and conflicts from others who we didn't invite. When Jeff, Z, and I attended our first class together on January 4, 1972, we were still committed to Francios’ teachings and philosophy.
It took us ten months of attending Jane's class to finally give up the philosophy we had been committed to under Francois, and to which we had devoted considerable energy toward getting others to believe in. The precise date I officially dropped Francios’ teachings was October 10, 1972, and the following comments are from notes I put together last year about various classes, so as time goes on I would have some kind of personal record.
October 10, 1972
"Jeff and I stayed at Sue Watkins’ apartment the weekend before class. Sue was living on Water Street, a few blocks from Jane at the time. Jeff drove up to Elmira in his van, and I had an anxiety attack on the way up; I told Jeff that I wanted him to let me out of the van so I could go home. Jeff had a bad sore throat on the way up. Z didn't attend this class. Seth spoke out about Francois. Sue Watkins played a role in this, for while Jeff and I were staying at her apartment I had told Sue how incredible Francois was, and she mentioned to Jane how entranced we all still were with Francois. Sue gave Jeff and me copies of transcripts of previous ESP classes, which Jeff and I took to the local library and copied. Shortly after this class I picked up some reincarnational information about a religious sect that Z, Jeff, and I belonged to centuries ago.
One of the first things I thought of doing as Seth was speaking about Francois was selling all my Gnostic books, and Seth said to me right after I was thinking this, "And do not worry about the angle at which you are leaning any more than a flower does." Jeff felt after this class that a great weight had been permanently lifted off him. In the transcript for this class, Seth talks about number 1, number 2, and number 3. This referred to the fact that in terms of being spiritually developed, we had viewed Francois as number 1, Seth as number 2, and Jane as a distant 3."
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Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: Seth speaking to me/Sue Watkins/Seth and class and
reincarnation
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:26:59 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
Any time Seth spoke directly to me there was a great impact, so I couldn‘t single out one statement as having the most impact on my life. But having said that, let me share with you some comments Seth made to me in May 1972. It was secret night, the first secret night I attended in Seth class, and to be totally honest, I picked a secret that wasn’t really charged for me, but I figured it would be scandalous enough to rate as a bona fide secret. I spoke of how I had used heroin many times, injecting it with a needle, snorting it, or just ingesting it. Someone asked what was I trying to escape and Seth came through and answered. What struck me the most about Seth’s answer was that despite my often joking and silly manner, Seth somehow knew the pain that lay just beneath the surface, and described it so poignantly and accurately may I add. So here is what Seth said:
"He was trying to escape the burden of consciousness, the burden of the mind that knows and knows that it knows; the burden of questions that seemingly come without end and without answer. He tried to follow his mind and to bite it as a cat will run in a circle trying to bite its tail and when he does he yells and he does not say I have enough of this. Again he looks around and the tail fascinates him and he runs around in another circle and merrily he goes on.
"Consciousness carries, in those terms, a burden for it seeks always to know itself. It tries to know its own psychic contents. As the eye cannot look into itself except for a mirror so you need physical reality. It is the mirror and when you refuse to look to use the mirror you do not see. He was afraid of the mirror, he was afraid of the tail but he did not then realize the vitality of consciousness or his own consciousness or the joy that gives it form. You made your consciousness into a monster that seemed to pursue you and so you wanted to escape it. But the innocence of consciousness of consciousness eluded you and is only now returning.
The second part of this post asked what Sue Watkins is up to these days. Sue is busy working with Sue Ray of Moment Point Press to republish Conversations With Seth. Both volume one and two will be published in one book. Separating the volumes will be an insert with photos of Jane, Rob, Sue, and various class members taken in Jane‘s living room at the time of class. There is also a great picture taken in the 1970’s of the boys from NY standing in front of the Roscoe Diner, which was the halfway point between NYC and Elmira and where we used to stop on the way up and on the way back. Rick Stack took the picture and has been kind enough to have copies made for use in the book. Sue will also be writing a new prologue for this new edition. And last but not least, Sue is in talks with Sue, (just a coincidence they have the same first name) about writing a bio of Jane which Moment Point Press will publish.
The last part of this post asked about whether there were any instances of Seth being reincarnationally connected to any members of class. Actually, there were a series of reincarnational dramas that arose in 1969 (before I went to class) which involved members of class around a campfire. This drama continued into 1972, and though I was attending class by then, I wasn’t at this particular class, but will quote from the transcript. There was general discussion about a scene by a campfire followed by the this dialogue:
Ruth: Were you there Seth?
Seth: I was indeed.
Ruth: At the campsite?
Seth: I was at the center of the campfire and Ruburt was there in another guise.
Ruth: Male?
Seth: He was indeed.
Ruth: Tall, thin.
Seth: He led you there at one previous class session.
Eleanor: Seth, did I give her a drink out of a gourd? It was a split gourd and I offered her this drink before she had to leave.
Seth: You did indeed.
Bee: I was there as a young boy.
Seth: You were.
Also in January, but from a class three years earlier, this campfire scene arose and I will quote from the transcript dated January 14, 1969.
Ruburt: Ruth, if you stay in that circle it is false security.
Ruth: I can’t leave until I can see where I am going.
Ruburt: There will be light. There will be light and there will be somebody else... I think me.
Ruth: I’d say that way...
Ruburt: I just know it’s a false security to stay in the group.
Ruth: I know this.
Ruburt: Because you have to go beyond that group at that time. Besides, there are two people in that group who are not really friendly. While they are here in this room now, frankly, they were not friendly at that time. I was one who was friendly at that time. It is only because I was there and you were there, at that time, that you can now realize this. This is apparently some kind of neurosis that you picked up that you can get over now, and only that you progressed so far in the end that you can. You have the opportunity to make adjustments and to leave the group when the night comes. You have the same sort of thing that Jane had but Jane is getting over it egotistically in this life. Although Jane’s was so strong she had to egotistically become more permissive. The sense of resistance has to do with the neurosis picked up in that time. In that time , you did not leave the group and you should have.
Now you have the opportunity to go back and leave the group. It is as if, in your terms, you see, you could go back to a period of this life where you should have acted in a different way and didn’t. Well you have the opportunity now to go back into that existence and make it different in the present. Because you can change–now this is in our physical terms– you can change what we would think of as the past through actions in our present. Do you understand me?
The past, in our terms, doesn’t cause present behavior because you can go back now into that past and change it in our present. You will have the opportunity to do it because of your intuitive understanding and this is something that most people haven’t developed enough to do. Now actually that circle and those people are as real as this room seems to the rest of you. Right now this room doesn’t seem very real to me. Now you can if you want to, and without any kind of coercion, look up and see Seth’s face. And in the face you’ll find confidence to leave the group, at that time. The confidence you find then will serve you now and help you in the daily life that you think you are leading now.
Ruth: Who are the unfriendly ones?
Ruburt: Starting with yourself, counting yourself, the third person down to your left, at that time, was in conflict with you. The fourth person beyond them was also in conflict with you and you were frightened of them. And because of them you stayed in the group, lacking confidence to go ahead.
Ruth C: I think I was one of the unfriendly ones.
Ruburt: Wait a minute. Answer me will you? Over a knoll... I feel a rise there.
Ruth K: Yes a wheat field.
Ruburt: OK. I don’t want to give you any suggestions, so you’ll have to answer me honestly. Do you sense anybody beyond that?
Ruth: No.
Ruburt: I sense somebody beyond that (wheat field) coming from the village that we talked about earlier; and I sense that you do not want to know that they are there.
Sue (Watkins): I’m the one in the field.
Ruth: This is it Jane. I’m rejecting... I’m not getting to see faces, but I can see Seth.
Ruburt: You’re all right then.
Ruth: Jane, let’s just forget it.
Ruburt: It’s too late.
Tom: Does she have to go by the two unfriendly figures to leave and reach the light?
Ruburt: No. There’s only one figure out in the wheat field that she doesn’t want to face.
Seth: Now cheer up!
Ruth: Here comes my... he’s not going to help me.
Seth: First of all you will not leave this group because you do not want to. You will work out your problems in the last group and I will help you do so if you want me to.
Ruth: You know I do.
Seth: I have a strong arm when it is mine. There are many probabilities and there is no problem.
Ruth: They’re of our own making, Seth.
Seth: You quote me. If you remember that you have no problems then that is the answer. You will not leave this group. If you want to you will leave the other group–with confidence. In one probability you have already done so.
Note: One week later in class of January 21, Sue Watkins told of a recurring dream which she had for some years, a dream in which she had stood in a field of wheat or corn. The field was afire and she feared for the safety of the village.
(If you want to read more about this campfire scene see Sue Watkins’ account in Conversations With Seth.)
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Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: Point of Power//Jane & Rob applying ideas/Other
Channels
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:27:22 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
I reread the sections you cited in The Nature of Personal Reality regarding Point Of Power and Natural Hypnosis, and also found it difficult to distinguish them. In line with what you said, in natural hypnosis Seth seems to have us concentrate on the mental repetition of a statement, while point of power seems more directed to visualization.
I don’t have a favorite manifesting technique, and to be honest, have not taken the time I should to work with these techniques. Sometimes I think I enjoy complaining about the areas I am unhappy about more than taking steps to change them. But as Seth says in the chapters you mention, with the right focus and with enough intensity, our reality can change dramatically and quickly. I’ll drink to that.
As far as Jane and Rob applying these techniques, I think they were like all of us. They applied Seth’s techniques with varying degrees of success. And again, like all of us, they often struggled with prioritizing their time. I guess the answer is if something is important enough to us, we can create the time for it, though it doesn’t always seem that simple. Yet, perhaps it is.
I haven’t encountered any "channels" besides Jane that have impressed me, but will use your question as an opportunity to address the idea of other people speaking for Seth. There was an excellent article written in 1989 by a fellow named Scott Smith, who used to write for The Coordinate Point. The name of the article was What In The Name of Seth is Going On? In my following discussion the quotes I use from Seth’s or Jane’s books are from Scott’s article and I thank him for the research he did wherever he may be.
When we first attended class, we never spoke of Jane channeling Seth. Actually, the word channeling was not even in vogue yet. Channeling to me sounds like such a cold term, as if Jane was just there so Seth could come through; as if Seth could have come through with equal clarity and effectiveness through any number of individuals.
In The "Unknown" Reality Seth said the following: "Ruburt and myself are offshoots of the same entity." In Psychic Politics Jane speaks of Seth as her own consciousness in a different context, one that I can tune into since its strands are interwoven with Seth’s. We are different kinds of beings, together yet apart. I am a self of Seth’s and he is a self of mine." From just these few quotes it is obvious Jane was more than a mere channel for Seth’s messages.
In The Seth Material we find Jane saying "Several people have told me that Seth communicated with them through automatic writing, but Seth denies any such contacts, saying that his communications will be limited to his work with me, in order that the integrity of the Seth material be preserved." From the introduction of Seth Speaks, Jane quotes Seth as saying "While my communications will come exclusively through Ruburt at all times, to protect the integrity of the material, I will invite the reader to become aware of me as a personality so that he may then realize that communication from other realities is possible, and that he himself if therefore open to perception that is not physical." On the one hand, we have Seth declaring he will only communicate through Jane, and yet on the other hand, since the publication of The Seth Material in 1970, at any given time we find numerous others claiming Seth is communicating through them. So either Seth is lying or he just can’t help moonlighting.
When you think of it, it was rather insightful of Seth, (maybe even psychic) <g> to anticipate at the outset that many others would start claiming they too were speaking for Seth, so he made it clear as to the exclusive nature of his communications. (And why would Seth choose now to jeopardize the integrity of the material?)
In Dreams, "Evolution," and Value Fulfillment, Jane had this to say: "...very troublesome to me...came the repeated news that various people were speaking for Seth publicly and charging hefty enough fees. I felt that my work was being contaminated, and more, I was annoyed and disappointed by those readers who could apparently be so taken in by those other Seths. As he has said so many times, Seth speaks only through me, to protect the integrity of the material. And it is indeed that contract between him and me that always assures you of the authenticity of Seth’s work." Jane continues: "I’m deeply outraged that some people who considered themselves followers of mine or Seth can so easily fool themselves when they claim to be speaking for Seth...be so blind to their own motives, or not recognize the fact that they’re taking advantage of people. They’re also using my work to validate their own.
One last thing I want to say regarding other channels, whoever they claim to be speaking for. I certainly understand the desire to seek knowledge and guidance from others. I spent years traveling to Jane Roberts’ living room seeking such knowledge. But if there was one message from Seth that was repeated as much as You Create Your Own Reality, it was the message that the answers we seek are to be found first and foremost within ourselves; that we each have our own Seth and our own Sumari; and that the greatest communications we should seek are those that arise from our own inner selves.
Seth always sought to lead us back to ourselves. While I believe we can help each other and learn from each other, I believe the clearest answers to our challenges are to be found within ourselves. And that was a major part of Seth’s teachings that I think we all need to pay more attention to.
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Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: First Car Ride/Drugs
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:27:40 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
I don’t recall the discussion on the first car ride to
class. I do recall that we were determined to keep a low profile.
(That never panned out.) As far as the discussion that took place
on the car ride home after that first class, I would love to have
a tape of that. I think it would probably be quite interesting
in hindsight. Perhaps you will settle for an account of the first
class I attended taken from notes I put together last year about
the classes.
January 4, 1972
As I walked up the flight of stairs that led to Jane Roberts'
living room at 458 West Water Street in Elmira, NY, I had little
idea of what awaited me. Just a few months before, I had read
Ms. Roberts' book The Seth Material, where Jane described
her experiences with Seth, an "energy essence personality,"
who spoke through her while she was in trance. I had never seen
a medium before, didn't know if Jane would go into trance this
particular
night, and if she did, I wondered what my reaction might be.
As I reached the top of the stairs, Jane was standing just outside the door of the apartment where her ESP classes, as she called them, were held. I recognized her from the photographs in The Seth Material, and as I approached the door to the living room Jane introduced herself and asked me my name. A simple enough question, yet from the brief exchange that occurred I should have known right then that I was in for an adventure, an adventure that continues to this day.
In response to her question I told Jane my name was Richard. Certainly a truthful statement on my part, yet Jane responded by asking me if I was called anything else. Instinctively I said no, yet in truth I was almost exclusively known by my nickname at that time, which was Dickie, and which I was trying to wean my friends from calling me. I was getting older and as an adult I just didn't feel comfortable with Dickie anymore. Jane accepted my response, and my denial that I was called anything else besides Richard and welcomed me to her class. She then walked across the hall to her other apartment. Jane and her husband, Robert F. Butts, occupied two apartments on the second floor of this grand old Victorian home and I proceeded to enter the apartment where classes were held.
There were approximately fifteen people in class that evening, some seated on the couch, others seated on chairs, and a few sitting on the floor in front of this handsome wooden rocking chair, unoccupied for the moment. I parked myself in the back of the room near the large bay windows that looked out upon Water Street. I could hear the steady though subdued hum of traffic beneath me, and not far away I could see the bridge that crossed the Chemung River, whose banks were to overflow some seven months later as a result of Hurricane Agnes, creating one of the worst natural disasters in Elmira's history. But tonight, as the river chugged peacefully along, I sat in anticipation, yet in anticipation of exactly what, I wasn't sure. Jane entered the living room at about 7:00 PM, sat down in the rocking chair, and began talking about some recent developments involving something called Sumari.
Suddenly, without any warning, Jane took off her glasses, lay them on the nearby coffee table, and began speaking in a loud deep masculine voice. Her eyes seemed darker, and her entire demeanor dramatically changed. The facial structure, softer just a moment ago, seemed tighter, as if the muscles were more alert, more focused in some way. The most striking change was the expression within the eyes as she spoke. I had never thought about it much before, but realized at that moment the intangible quality within the eyes of every person, which somehow stamps their identity as unique, distinguishing them from all others. For all intents and purposes, this was someone other than Jane, who was now speaking. Whatever one decided to call that other-spirit, ghost, guide, entity, angel or demon, there was a personality behind those eyes that was not Jane's of a moment ago.
Energy essence personality was the term used in The Seth Material, and that seems as apt a description as any. Seth began to speak, easily and forcefully, talking about what he called the Sumari, and how they were gathering together from near and afar. My two friends and I had just traveled five and one half hours from New York City to Elmira to attend Jane's class, so that certainly fit Seth's comment about traveling from afar. Yet I had no idea what Sumari was, though I was to going to find out a lot sooner than I would have thought. As easily as Jane had gone into trance and started speaking for Seth, she now started singing, powerful tones began emanating from this petite woman, hitting high and low notes with the versatility and true pitch of a trained opera singer. Even if one considered the words she sang to be gibberish, the display of vocal agility in itself was astounding. The syllables and notes seemed to bounce off the walls and though the words did not correspond to any known language, there was a familiarity to it all that resonated within me, as if I had heard this type of singing before, though when or where I couldn't say.
When the song ended, Jane put her glasses back on and various students shared their reactions to the Sumari singing that had just taken place. When I was asked about my feelings concerning the singing I had just heard, I said that I felt I had been given a gift. Seth then came through again saying that each time the Sumari sings or speaks we are indeed being given a gift, and that it was up to us to decipher that gift. I wasn't quite ready to decipher anything at this point, and was glad when Jane called a break. She got up from her rocker during break, and walked across the hall to her other apartment. It was understood that the fifteen minutes or so she spent during the class break in her apartment across the hall was her break as well; in other words, do not disturb was written in clear though invisible letters across the door of her other apartment during break time. How something could be written in clear but invisible letters I might have questioned a few minutes ago, but after experiencing Seth, and the Sumari singing, something being invisible and tangible at the same time seemed suddenly quite plausible.
During break, class members spoke in animated fashion about various topics that today one would place in the category of new age. In 1972 the term new age didn't even exist, but that did not deter anyone from having experiences such as precognitive dreams, out-of-body experiences, psychic happenings, past life or reincarnational dramas, speaking of which...
As Jane reentered the room after break, the atmosphere was truly alive with lots of discussions, lots of laughter, and a feeling of camaraderie, though some of us had met for the first time that evening, or had we?
Fred was a pleasant looking young man who seemed both friendly and intelligent as he participated in class that evening. So when one of the class members turned to me and asked why I was feeling all this anger toward Fred I began to squirm in my seat. My instinctive reaction was to deny feeling any anger toward this fellow I had never met, though in fact, each time he spoke during class I found my anger toward him growing. Then another member of class asked "Why is Fred on trial?" and I had a feeling I was about to experience my own trial of sorts.
In the next moment Jane was back in trance, singing in that Sumari language, and motioned for me and Fred to stand up together in front of her. We acceded to her request and stood on either side of Jane as she continued to sing in those vibrant powerful tones. Fred and I were facing each other as Jane continued to sing, and she then put Fred's and my hands together. As the singing continued I could feel the anger within me starting to fade, and I smiled at Fred. Yet secretly, (I thought), I was still holding on to some of that anger.
Jane, while still singing and still in trance, once again put her hands over Fred's and mine and shook them, and all the anger truly dissipated, and Fred and I laughed as Jane ended the song. Before we had time to barely blink, Seth came through Jane again, looked at me, and said, "Let that be a lesson to you." It was not said in a mean spirited way, (no pun intended), and I knew the intent was simply to make a point, and I did not feel put down or demeaned in any way.
When Jane came out of trance, I learned that Jane, as well
as a few of the other class members while listening to the Sumari
song, had images of a trial, with me being the judge, and Fred
being accused of some kind of adultery, or some similar kind of
misbehavior. As the judge I cut him no slack for his misdeeds,
and I later learned that the Sumari song was meant to evoke within
us memories of these events. It was also determined that Pete,
a friend of Fred's who was in class that night, and Jeffrey, a
friend of mine, who drove up to class with me that evening, were
witnesses at this trial. Bee, one of the local Elmirans who regularly
attended class was supposed to have been the scribe at this trial.
I now felt able to admit that I had indeed been feeling anger
toward Fred since class had began, but was defensive about it
when called on it. Jane told me that it was no big deal, that
we all get defensive, and in some inexplicable way I felt like
I
had come home.
Class ended at about 11:00 that evening, and as we began the long drive back to New York City we were filled with energy. It was our own energy, awakened from the events of a remarkable evening; a natural high if ever there was one. My friend Jeffrey started telling me how amazed he was when I was standing in front of Jane and singing along with the Sumari. Singing with the Sumari? I honestly had no recollection of doing so, but at this point if Jeffrey told me that the couch levitated while the people were sitting on it I don't think I would have doubted it. There was a lot to think about, to try to sort out, and each answer just seemed to bring more questions.
After a few hours on the road we finally started to feel tired. Few cars traveled route 17 at this time of night. The trucks however kept us company, as headlights played tag with each other, passing, falling behind, and then passing again. Our other companions were the diners, rising up like some strange road creatures and rearing their dimly lit heads. Yes, there was a lot to think about, and though no words were spoken, we knew our lives would never be the same.
As to your question about attending class in an altered state I assume you mean on drugs. By the time we went to class our drug days had been behind us for a few years. I’m not saying no one ever did a drug again, but going to Jane’s class on drugs is just something we never considered. Yet ironically, the last class we attended, which turned out to be the last class Jane held, did involve an issue concerning drugs. Once again from my notes:
September 29, 1979
This was the last class any of us attended.
A few members of the NYC crew came to class high. After class, Jane found a pill on the floor, and though nothing about it was said at the time, we later learned during a visit to Elmira in 1980 that Jane had been quite pissed off. Sometime in 1980, Jeff, Sheri Perl, and I went up to the Elmira area to see if we could find from former class members some ESP Class tapes that we didn't have. I don't think we had specific dates in mind, but it was more of a "fishing expedition."
Sheri called Jane to see if we could stop by, and Jane declined our offer to visit. Sheri was very upset by Jane's reaction and started crying. I called Jane back to see what was going on. When I talked to Jane she said the reason for not wanting to see us was that she was angry about the fact that people came to that September 29, 1979 class high; that after all these years of going to her class we still felt that we needed drugs to find the magic of our being. I think part of her felt that none of us had really "gotten" the messages she was trying to get across to us.
After the phone call, Jane did end up letting us visit. Connected to Jane's comments, I believe, was her often made comment that she wondered if her books and the classes were really helping anyone change his or her lives for the better.
[ Go to the top ]
Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: Jane as teacher/Structure of class
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:28:02 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
Jane was in my estimation a fantastic teacher. There were always a lot of charged emotions in that room, and Jane had an uncanny ability to give us all a long leash, yet knew when to reign things in. I think class was a great model for the proposition that spontaneity knows its own order, that spontaneity creates its own structure.
As far as knowing from week to week what we would be discussing, Jane used to write an outline before class, (for herself) of the topics she wanted to cover that evening, and if she got through the first one on her list before we veered into other directions it would be a miracle. The closest we came to knowing beforehand what would be discussed at the next class was when Jane gave us belief assignments. We were to write down our beliefs during the week on various topics she picked, and not sign our name to the belief paper we wrote. Then in class, the papers would be randomly handed out and read by various class members, and we would discuss our reaction to various beliefs presented in the papers.
Your last question about Jane not allowing people to return to class, that happened rarely. I do recall one time, when class was suspended for a few weeks, and Jane said she would call those she wanted back when class resumed.
The only other comment I have along these lines, is in later years, after they had moved to the hill house, Jane spoke one class about how certain people who had attended class in the past, used to drive her up a wall. This surprised me, because Jane dealt so evenhandedly in class with everyone.
[ Go to the top ]
Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: Pseudonyms in Conversations With Seth
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:28:17 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
Your question as to why certain people felt they had to use pseudonyms in Sue Watkins’ book is not a rude question, and certainly has symbolic significance. Unfortunately, I can‘t answer it because I really don’t recall how or why the issue of pseudonyms arose.
The issue did come up briefly with the upcoming republication of Conversations With Seth, and I will let you know if anything changes along these lines.
Then again, from someone who legally changed their name from Richard Nissenbaum to Richard Kendall, maybe I’m not the best person to speak of pseudonyms. <G>
[ Go to the top ]
Subject: [ESP
Class] Changes in view of creating your own reality
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:28:45 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
I think the concept of creating our own reality is not meant to be static, and never could be. I believe It is too huge a concept to be contained within any one set of interpretive boundaries, but will change as we change, and change as our life experience changes. I would love to be able to tell you (and tell me) that I finally have it all fine-tuned, and I get up each morning and just create each day exactly as I want. I could tell you that but it wouldn’t be the truth. There are also times I ask myself, when will I finally get it, finally remove all obstacles and live in the land of endless value fulfillment. But I’m not sure that is the end result of all this, though I certainly don‘t think suffering must be a necessary adjunct to our existence either.
I don’t think we can, or should even attempt, to determine in advance all of the ramifications of this exploration we are embarked upon. I think changes in our viewpoint, interpretations, and feelings about creating our own reality, are a natural part of the journey toward understanding the concept. I believe that from the moment we seek to live our lives under the premise that we create our own reality we begin an amazing adventure, (An Adventure In Consciousness) one might say. Let the adventure at least be fun. And if it stops being fun, .... well, you know the rest.
[ Go to the top ]
Subject: [ESP
Class] Re: Stops being fun/Paddleball
Date: Mon,
18 Jan 1999 01:28:31 EST
From: RKNewYork@aol.com
Reply-To: sethnet@onelist.com
To: sethnet@onelist.com
The statement of Seth’s that "If it stops being fun, stop doing it," created quite a stir when he first came out with that. I think that comment has a lot of wisdom within it. I know some might say, well if my job isn’t fun should I just stop doing it even though I need my weekly paycheck to cover the mortgage. But Seth never said stop doing it this instant. (Now that really would have created a stir.) I think the greater message in that statement is that there are areas in our lives where we put energy into that do not bring value fulfillment, and yet we continue to focus energy in those areas, and we need to ask ourselves why.
Seth once spoke of having a responsibility to our own joy, so we must ask ourselves why we continue to focus energy toward activities or situations that are not fun, and may even make us miserable and yet we don’t stop. When a child stops having fun playing a game, he just stops playing that game and looks for another one that will be more fun. Perhaps it really can be that simple.
And now to your question regarding my beloved paddleball. I do not play paddleball anymore. However, I live right near a park, and on weekend mornings I can hear the sounds of paddleball being played; I can hear the sounds of the racquet hitting the ball and the sounds of the ball bouncing off the wall. And in some crazy way, that’s enough.
Peace.
RK